70th Anniversary of the Pearl Harbor Attack.

The thing is that Japan didn't declare war. No matter what meta nonsense happened, Japan attacked us without declaring war. That's not okay, and that's why it's a big deal.

I don't understand why Americans are so quick to denounce Japan for not declaring war when they haven't formally declared war on anybody since the Korean War, which would make all of their wars from 1950 a 'big deal'. In Japan's defense, it was their only real way to declare it without getting completely decimated.

Declaring war is only possible when you're engaging in war.

War is a state on state affair, and despite the nominal status of things like the "War on Terror" or "War on Drugs" we are not actually at war. Japan engaged in state-state conflict with the obvious intention of going to war with the United States, but did not declare it until after they had attacked us. It's ridiculous to compare what Japan did with what we do today.

I see what you're saying, but look at it from Tojo's point of view, f they declared war before hand then their surprise attack would have failed, and defeat would have been sure from the start. It was the only way they could have a fighting chance. And so what if they broke the rules of war, it's not like it's stopped them before, and what are the Americans going to do about it? Declare a war? Well, yeah, that's the idea.

But yeah, that's the Japanese point of view.

I know why they did it, but that doesn't make it any less terrible for us. My point was that Toast's nonsense about Americans whining over it is ridiculous, as we have every right to make a big deal out of it.

Well, maybe not in the modern day, I mean come on, get over it.

Iraq? Afghanistan? Maybe?

If Japan did declare war before they attacked Pearl Harbor, they would have been crushed. Simple as that.

Those aren't wars against states. Their conflicts with organizations overseas.

The Invasion of Iraq certainly was.

We are not at war with Iraq nor are we at war with Afghanistan. We are in fact allied in our current armed conflict with both of them, and render significant military aid to both of them.

That doesn't mean that we're going to ignore that they broke the rules of war, or that we're whiners for pointing that out. Japan was in the wrong here, very clearly.

I'm talking about 2003, with the whole issue with Saddam Hussein. Instead of Afghanistan, I could put forth North Vietnam instead.

Yes. That doesn't mean you have to be so passionate about it more than 70 years after it. It was a great surprise attack and it will be remembered as that.

I don't know man, when you think about it, who really won WWII? I mean the Empire of Japan still exists, and we never invaded them. Is it possible that they are the true victors?

The attack was planed to start 30 minutes after Japan had informed the United States that peace negotiations were at an end, but the attack began before the notice could be delivered.

Claim your sources, it's about an official deceleration of war which the Japanese did not do.

Tennoheika banzai!!! 天皇陛下万歳!!!

Yamamoto was a military genius, one of the best Japan ever had, and one of the best naval warfare theorists at the time.

You should be using トラ・トラ・トラ! for the Pearl Harbor attacks. Yamamoto was a clever guy, and he predicted the result of the war after Pearl Harbor and got it spot on. It would have gone a lot better in Japan's favor if the guy was given more say in the attack.

Indeed.
And yeah I know "tora tora tora!" would be more appropriate but "天皇陛下万歳!!!" just sounds better.

Well, we pretty openly said we were going into Iraq on several occasions. And at the time we considered Afghanistan as attacking us in 9/11.

They could've ordered a diplomat in Washington to tell them the declaration of war 10 minutes beforehand. It's still a dick move, but it wouldn't compromise the sneak attack.