Noam Chomsky - Propaganda, American style

Discussion in 'The Political/Current Events Coffee House' started by Bart, Dec 9, 2011.

  1. Bart (Moderator) NKVD Channel Maintainer

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 2011
    Message Count:
    4,048
    Likes Received:
    578
    Trophy Points:
    294
    Location:
    Nootdorp, The Netherlands
    What are your thoughts on this essay (1988) by Noam Chomsky? I personally agree with most of what he says and I think it's a very interesting essay.
  2. TheKoreanPoet Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2011
    Message Count:
    1,273
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    I don't know who noam chomsky is but i do know who gnone chomsky is.
    (Hi 5 if you get the reference)
  3. Viking Socrates I am Mad Scientist

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2011
    Message Count:
    9,153
    Likes Received:
    1,487
    Trophy Points:
    248
    Location:
    In a cave,watching shadows (Plato reference)
    I love hearing anything by Noam Chomsky so this will be interesting to read, My thoughts will be with you momentarily.
  4. Kalalification Guest

    Member Since:
    Message Count:
    0
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Well I think the fact that he's able to express his radical ideas and platform kind of detracts from his argument that America is an Orwellian dystopia. To be fair, he's usually not that crazy or radical, but he almost always picks his topics with the express intent of making mountains out of molehills.
  5. Viking Socrates I am Mad Scientist

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2011
    Message Count:
    9,153
    Likes Received:
    1,487
    Trophy Points:
    248
    Location:
    In a cave,watching shadows (Plato reference)
    While he does make points, he seems to overstate things way to much and was propley one of those overly dramatic children who thought a D meant the end of the world or something. While America has its faults and problems it is no way a Orwellian Dystopia, Unless we all been mind controlled into thinking its good while we all slave away for our Imperial British overlords.
  6. Achtung Kommunisten! Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Mar 25, 2011
    Message Count:
    1,962
    Likes Received:
    340
    Trophy Points:
    143
    Location:
    Birmingham, United Kingdom, European Union
    Quiet you. Get back to your toil for Queen and Country- I mean continue enjoying your democracy. Liberty and America and that!
  7. Karakoran Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2011
    Message Count:
    7,903
    Likes Received:
    640
    Trophy Points:
    193
    Location:
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    He seems to think we've engineered history. Which seems kind of ridiculous given ever ounce of my American history classes have been bitching about how terrible America acted. Apparently when we weren't raping the Indian women, lynching Blacks, and oppressing the Mexicans, we were overthrowing every democracy in the world for dictatorships.

    Anyone who thinks we've been getting the best of our history has never taken an American history class in America. A People's History of America is considered reasonable material for God's sake.

    "One is that the Sandinista government doesn't slaughter its population. That's a well-recognized fact." I refuse to take anything from this essay seriously.
  8. CrazyManiac Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2011
    Message Count:
    185
    Likes Received:
    29
    Trophy Points:
    68
    Location:
    Finland
    He wrote a very good essay,technically but i dont really care. Since im one of the "un-educated" ones :p
  9. Lenin Cat Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Message Count:
    2,591
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    108
    Location:
    New York
    Ive taken them, and I'm forced fed the idea that if I try hard enough ill be rich, and I can change the government radically in elections. Also apparently every war is done for humanitarian reasons, not imperialism.
  10. Viking Socrates I am Mad Scientist

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2011
    Message Count:
    9,153
    Likes Received:
    1,487
    Trophy Points:
    248
    Location:
    In a cave,watching shadows (Plato reference)
    America bombing cities and destroying lives to save them from a threat since 1776.....but only if you have something they want. Also check out this Link: http://www.krysstal.com/democracy_whyusa.html
  11. Kalalification Guest

    Member Since:
    Message Count:
    0
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Both of which are true.

    That's just nonsense. The AP US History course I took devoted an entire section (about 2-3 weeks) to American imperialism. One of the AP essay questions during the actual test was (and I quote; I've still got the test booklet in one of my folders) "In what ways did the ideas of imperialism impact US foreign policy and the domestic political climate in the 19th and early 20th centuries?"

    Except for WWII, pretty much all chapters dealing with American wars tried to portray our cause as unjust or spent inordinate amounts of time on pointing out that there were tangible, material interests as well as ideological ones behind conflicts.

    American history courses overwhelmingly portray us in a negative light, and the experience I personally had was far more similar to Kara's than to Lenin's.
  12. Lenin Cat Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Message Count:
    2,591
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    108
    Location:
    New York
    Becoming rich needs a enormous amount of luck, plenty of people try and fall on there head. The only radical changes post bill of rights were brought through mass protest and civil disobedience.
  13. CoExIsTeNcE LeonTrotsky in Disguse

    Member Since:
    Feb 16, 2011
    Message Count:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    255
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    What history course did you take? Half of our essays, independent book readings, and chapters in the text book dealt with an unequal America that has in the passed worked in its own interests rather than the ideals it was built on.

    You can do all those things in your first sentence by the way.
  14. Lenin Cat Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Message Count:
    2,591
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    108
    Location:
    New York
    World History, US History, currently in Government, taking Economics second half of the year.
  15. CoExIsTeNcE LeonTrotsky in Disguse

    Member Since:
    Feb 16, 2011
    Message Count:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    255
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Hey, me too. (Except add a European History to that.) I still cannot imagine that they would paint America in such a good light.
  16. Viking Socrates I am Mad Scientist

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2011
    Message Count:
    9,153
    Likes Received:
    1,487
    Trophy Points:
    248
    Location:
    In a cave,watching shadows (Plato reference)
    Pretty much I've learned in the entire history of the united state is we started off the freest truest country ever, then turned into giant assholes. Also that the american government is very corrupt and all that other nice stuff.

    To brake down my classes I have, Earth/space--- we're we learn that out teacher is from the former soviet union and he calls america the greatest country ever and everyone needs to shut the fuck up because we don't know how good we have it, VIVA LA AMERICA or something like that.

    Sociology- We pretty much talk about how Capitalism is far better then communism, and how welfare is a drain on society and we're a nation of whiny babies who ask for more stuff. blah blah other unimportant classes

    A.P World--- Our teacher is a libertarian and talks about the world and helping others, and that america has turned against its self in recent years, and that we change history. oh and that we all formerly agree CHINA FUCKING SUCKS.Free Tibet and all that stuff, oh and then we talk about African Politics and the future (Personally my favorite teacher I have this year)

    English--- Our stupid theme of this year is Culture, It tells us we must learn to love and respect other cultures and be kind, then it talks about Iran.......Yep I'm going with this is a plot to make us invade them.
  17. Bart (Moderator) NKVD Channel Maintainer

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 2011
    Message Count:
    4,048
    Likes Received:
    578
    Trophy Points:
    294
    Location:
    Nootdorp, The Netherlands
    No. Getting rich requires luck and friends. Also, in the US, people probably have the least influence on the government of any real democracy, because you work with electors, and not with actual votes. And the rich can have much more influence on the government than the poor, because they can finance campaigns and stuff like that.

    And the sad part is, the US gained much more influence via WWII than all of those other sneaky things.

    I know he exaggerates, but his point is, that the US hides a lot of it's propaganda. Have you ever watched one of those Warner or Disney cartoons from the 1940's (or even recent ones)? That's obviously propaganda.

    And the sad part is, your stupid propaganda even gets here too. People in here act like it was the US which saved us from National-Socialism. And like the US is the most liberal country in the world. The truth: It isn't. Two decades ago, homosexuals couldn't even get in the country because they were said to spread aids.
  18. D3VIL Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2011
    Message Count:
    885
    Likes Received:
    82
    Trophy Points:
    78
    Location:
    UK
    Chomsky has said numerous times that there is no correlation between the internal freedom of a state and it's external actions. And he often states that the topics are chosen by the institutions at which he speaks. I'd urge you to watch some of his lectures, maybe you'll get a better understanding of him.

    In my opinion Chomksy is fantastic. Brilliantly well read, backs his points with evidence and applies his judgement equally without prejudice.
  19. UnholyKnight800 Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Feb 13, 2011
    Message Count:
    3,003
    Likes Received:
    290
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    That house
    Of course it wasn't the US, it was Canada.
  20. Karakoran Well-Known Member

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2011
    Message Count:
    7,903
    Likes Received:
    640
    Trophy Points:
    193
    Location:
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    No, it requires talent and being about to cooperate with people. Or extreme luck, but you'll always have the person who slips through. Hell, I could go now and invest everything I own in some small company and maybe I'd get lucky and hit the jackpot. A game of chance isn't unfair.

    Obviously this makes our people the least influencing of their government. Politicians appeal to the people, not to the rich. Major donators are not the rich, they're special interest groups and unions. Bill Gates doesn't donate much.

    Yes, made by a Company. What, do you want us to censor them?

    Are you trying to say you had it in the bag before America showed up?
    The Soviets were just one move away from closing their trap before America ruined everything?

    The USSR was so boned it was fleeing to the Urals.
    What?
    No shit, Sherlock.
    The 1990s? I don't think that's true.

Share This Page

Facebook: