Liberty vs. Security

Discussion in 'The Political/Current Events Coffee House' started by The Shaw, Apr 15, 2012.

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Liberty or Security?

Liberty 22 vote(s) 73.3%
Security 8 vote(s) 26.7%
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  1. The Shaw Rawnald Gregory Erickson the Second

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    I didn't know if this belonged in Politics or Philosophy, so if a mod thinks it belongs in Philosophy feel free to move it.
    Hypothetically, if you were tasked with giving up one for the sake of the other, what would you do? Which is more important? If given the choice between one or the other, which would you choose?
    I think everybody knows my stance on the issue. And I will try not to debate on this, for I want to observe.
    The Shaw, Apr 15, 2012
    #1

  2. Viking Socrates I am Mad Scientist

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    Look at Shaw's Sig, now you know my views as well.
    Viking Socrates, Apr 15, 2012
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  3. SovietEmpireUSSR Well-Known Member

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    Those who would give up Essential Liberty
    to purchase a little Temporary Safety,
    deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
    SovietEmpireUSSR, Apr 15, 2012
    #3
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  4. Imperial1917 City-States God of War

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    Why is it that people always have to choose between the two?
    Imperial1917, Apr 15, 2012
    #4
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  5. The Shaw Rawnald Gregory Erickson the Second

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    Then you are a hypocrite for admiring the Soviet Union.

    If. And it comes up often. I'm not saying you can only have one or the other, but if presented with the choice...
    The Shaw, Apr 15, 2012
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  6. Demondaze Xenos Scum

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    Indeed. Fuck this dichotomy.
    Demondaze, Apr 15, 2012
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  7. The Shaw Rawnald Gregory Erickson the Second

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    Again, hypothetically, if were tasked with giving up one for the sake of the other, what would you do?
    The Shaw, Apr 15, 2012
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  8. SovietEmpireUSSR Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, the Soviet Union was such a highly technological police state, anyone who spoke out against the government was begging to be thrown in the gulag. Oh, no, the secret police, how that secret apparatus was so evil. However, I think that quote is silly. I think we need protection and security in society, but leaving the civil rights intact and kept in preservation.
    SovietEmpireUSSR, Apr 15, 2012
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  9. Kali The World's Best Communist

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    Because security sacrifices opportunity, and therefore liberty. There are some cases where you might be able to see such an extremely small net loss in liberty that it could be said to be effectively neutral, but in issues of major policy it's an absolutely true dichotomy.
    Kali, Apr 15, 2012
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  10. The Shaw Rawnald Gregory Erickson the Second

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    The Soviet Union didn't really allow people to do whatever they wanted, enforced draconian laws and punishments, and was highly secure.
    The Shaw, Apr 15, 2012
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  11. Imperial1917 City-States God of War

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    You misunderstood my post or I misunderstood the OP.
    My understanding of the OP was extreme to one side or extreme to the other, both of which I find reproachable.
    Imperial1917, Apr 15, 2012
    #11

  12. The Shaw Rawnald Gregory Erickson the Second

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    Maybe I wasn't clear, hypothetically, if were tasked with giving up one for the sake of the other, what would you do?
    I'll also edit that into the OP.
    The Shaw, Apr 15, 2012
    #12

  13. Kali The World's Best Communist

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    It appears you did.
    Kali, Apr 15, 2012
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  14. SovietEmpireUSSR Well-Known Member

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    Believe all the nonsense, sounds like the United States of today. highly secured, investing in public and private surveillance because your literally shitting yourself from "terrorism" when in reality your government is slowly becoming bigger and passing draconian laws like (NDAA) and proposing ones like SOPA, ACTA, etc
    SovietEmpireUSSR, Apr 15, 2012
    #14
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  15. Kali The World's Best Communist

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    No it doesn't. That comparison is ridiculous and you know it.
    Kali, Apr 15, 2012
    #15

  16. The Shaw Rawnald Gregory Erickson the Second

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    I know. But the USSR was worse. I will in no way defend the security measures of the US, however.
    The Shaw, Apr 15, 2012
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  17. Imperial1917 City-States God of War

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    You are wrong. The Shaw agreed with me that the OP wasn't as clear as it should have been.
    Hmm... security methinks.
    Can't be secure if someone is constantly threatening you with a firing squad, now can you?
    Imperial1917, Apr 15, 2012
    #17

  18. The Shaw Rawnald Gregory Erickson the Second

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    That doesn't make any sense. Execution is a security measure...
    The Shaw, Apr 16, 2012
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  19. Imperial1917 City-States God of War

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    Security for the other people.
    Bullets to my brain don't exactly make my life secure.
    Imperial1917, Apr 16, 2012
    #19

  20. Demondaze Xenos Scum

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    This is makes no sense. To imply that you can't have both or that one lessens the other is like saying that by having money or food a man is some how less free, regardless of how he achieved his security. Liberty, security, and justice are all the same beast, in truth you can't have one without the other.
    And this constant insinuation that security somehow equals oppression is about as sickening as the reds and their views on "justice".
    Demondaze, Apr 16, 2012
    #20
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