At what point was Nazi Germany doomed to defeat?

Discussion in 'Historical Events Coffee House' started by Sokol-1, Jan 20, 2012.

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At what point was Nazi Germany doomed to defeat?

From the very beginning (Fall, 1939) 1 vote(s) 1.9%
From the defeat in the Battle of Britain (Summer, 1940) 3 vote(s) 5.6%
From the beginning of the invasion of Russia (Summer, 1941) 12 vote(s) 22.2%
From the failure to capture Moscow/American Entry into the War (Winter, 1941) 19 vote(s) 35.2%
From the defeats at Stalingad and El Alamein (Fall, 1942) 10 vote(s) 18.5%
From the defeat in Tunisia (Spring, 1943) 0 vote(s) 0.0%
From the beginning of effective strategic bombing (1943) 1 vote(s) 1.9%
From the defeat at Kursk (Summer, 1943) 6 vote(s) 11.1%
From D-Day (Summer, 1944) 1 vote(s) 1.9%
From the defeat at the Battle of the Bulge (Winter, 1944) 1 vote(s) 1.9%
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  1. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    No and it would be counter productive because of reason I mentioned.
    D3adtrap, Apr 8, 2012
    #61

  2. yuri2045 A Marines Biologist

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    Point being, the Italians fucked with Hitler by not doing their job as they should.
    yuri2045, Apr 8, 2012
    #62
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  3. Shisno Doesn't know who did this

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    The Italians is a reason why the Germans lost the war. They just sucked at fighting. It is like when they attacked Greece, the Greek army actually repulsed them, and began to invade Albania! Thus the Germans had to give up a few critical weeks to fix a problem the Italians started. With North Africa, the Italians invaded British Libya, and were repulsed. Thus Hitler committed Rommel and the Afrika Corps to deal with it. The Italians were the bane of the Nazis.
    Shisno, Apr 8, 2012
    #63
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  4. Daddy92 Well-Known Member

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    hey hey hey that s my people you re talking about yea the generals were crap, the dictator was crap but still our soldier tried as hard as they could even without winter gear and our alpini were know as white devils by the russians and even the folgore(parachute brigade)put up an hell of a fight, anyway even with that i have to say that hitler was fucked when he decided to ally with the japanese.
    Daddy92, Apr 8, 2012
    #64

  5. Shisno Doesn't know who did this

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    I will agree with you. It was the generals, the politicians and the lack of raw materials and modern supplies that fucked the Italians. But on a soldier level, they were fine.
    Shisno, Apr 8, 2012
    #65

  6. Toast Well-Known Member

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    No they didn't. The Italians were well and truly terrible fighters. They might've even cost Germany the war. In fact, the Italians could hardly even put up a fight against Ethiopia - they even lost one war against the Ethiopians. The only reason the Italians won the war against the Ethiopians a second time was because they reverted to chemical warfare. The rest of their wars was just Germany doing everything for them.
    Toast, Apr 8, 2012
    #66
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  7. slydessertfox Total War Branch Head

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    Didn't the Italians like surrender amost instantaneously when the allies landed on the mainland?
    slydessertfox, Apr 8, 2012
    #67

  8. Toast Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't really matter whether or not the Italians surrendered. After all, Germany fought in Italy instead of the Italians anyway.
    Toast, Apr 8, 2012
    #68
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  9. Shisno Doesn't know who did this

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    Actually, partisans overthrew Mussolini and effectively left the war. Then Germany made the shit decision to (attempt) an occupation of all of Italy while they were fighting the USSR. They also rescued Mussolini from his holding cell at some mountain, and reinstated him, if just as a German puppet.
    Shisno, Apr 8, 2012
    #69
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  10. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    That proves nothing. Mud season lasts for about a month in fall. Also are you arguing that Germans could advance in these conditions?
    [IMG]
    [IMG]
    [IMG]
    D3adtrap, Apr 8, 2012
    #70

  11. Shisno Doesn't know who did this

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    It proves the mud didn't slow down the Germans enough for their offensive to just stop.
    Shisno, Apr 8, 2012
    #71

  12. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    No it does not. It shows German progress over long period of time, without any updates or notes. Germans stopped for a month and continued the next.
    D3adtrap, Apr 8, 2012
    #72

  13. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    And that is why it's flawed. It at no point separates German advance during mud season from other times.
    D3adtrap, Apr 8, 2012
    #73

  14. Daddy92 Well-Known Member

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    the first ethiopian war was lost because of bad leadership, lack of maps around adua ,poor communications and the italians were outnumbered 3 to 1 36 000 against 100000 the italian generals at that time lacked of combat experience and common sense ,the soldiers werent part of the problem.
    the date is 3th september 1943
    Daddy92, Apr 8, 2012
    #74

  15. yuri2045 A Marines Biologist

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    Goddammit, deleted my post instead of editing.
    But yes, i'm interested at it now, do you have a map or something that shows it?
    yuri2045, Apr 8, 2012
    #75

  16. Toast Well-Known Member

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    It wasn't just the Italian generals who lacked experience and common sense, it was the soldiers, also.
    Toast, Apr 8, 2012
    #76
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  17. yuri2045 A Marines Biologist

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    Do not forget the logistics of carrying over suplies.
    yuri2045, Apr 8, 2012
    #77
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  18. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    I do not have a map, but I got here a Inferno The world at war 1939-1945 by Max Hastings and I've skipped to what period we're discussing now (I'm yet to read this that far). Quickly looking trough it German account says that they could not move on October 17th. I can give you a bigger picture only if you give me a minute.
    D3adtrap, Apr 8, 2012
    #78

  19. Shisno Doesn't know who did this

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    Can we get back on topic?
    Shisno, Apr 8, 2012
    #79

  20. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    If you have access to Dan Carlins HH Ghosts of the ost front, go there as I don't have episodes downloaded on this computer.
    D3adtrap, Apr 8, 2012
    #80
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