(False) Historical stereotypes

Discussion in 'Historical Events Coffee House' started by D3adtrap, Jul 5, 2012.

  1. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    Does not need any further explanation, this thread should purify our brain from evil ignorance that pollutes our society in general these days.

    I'll start of with a myth of Russian Imperial army being shit during WW1. Russians won the biggest battle of WW1, Brusilov offensive with astonishing results for the time. Russians lost 500 000 men in comparison of central powers 1,3 million. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brusilov_Offensive Compared to battle of Somme brits & french lost 600 000 to German 4-500 000.

    When it comes to fighting Ottomans, man they beat them hand over fist slaughtering them. On major offensives they some times reached 7 to 1 KDR.

    So yeah that happened... Please do continue
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  2. UtterlyImpeccable Well-Known Member

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    I think it's more the fact that many of them didn't have shoes, and that in some cases there was one gun for every four soldiers.
  3. Soviet Streltsy Well-Known Member

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    Brusilov was Russia's only hope for World War I. Yet the Czar couldn't see past his own nose to see that... think of the possibilities if Brusilov would've had more support and more authority. He could've turned the Central's march in Russia into a retreat to Berlin and Vienna.
  4. MayorEmanuel Do not weep, for salvation is coming.

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    It's not a myth.

    So you're saying that basically Russia's only successful offensive of the war provides proof that were not terrible. The ghosts of Tannenberg and the Masurian Lakes would like to have a word with you.

    This actually shows Russia's incompetence, Yudenich was one of Russia's best generals but was placed on the least important front of the war.
  5. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    @MayorEmanuel Yet this is with out a shadow of doubt the most prestigious major victory of first world war and slaughtering enemies hand over fist shows ones incompetence? Don't make me laugh, because that's barely funny.
  6. Surfusa Lost in space-time

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    Many people believe that the wars of 1812 were Russia against France and the United States against the United Kingdoms. In actuallity, Russia was against the United State while France and the United Kingdoms declared war on the moon.
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  7. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    @MayorEmanuel

    I calculated specific number of casualties on ww1 eastern front purely based off wikipedia stats, which -let's not kid our selves- are reliable. Here's link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Front_(World_War_I) and here's what I found out (these are not super specific, I ignored 1ks)

    Russia & Romania

    1 342 000 dead/missing
    2 200 000 wounded
    3 340 000 POW
    6 882 000 total

    Central powers

    1 950 000 dead/missing
    3 200 000 wounded
    2 200 000 pow
    7 350 000 total

    Difference:

    600 000 dead/missing
    1 000 000 wounded
    1 140 000 POW (this one in favor of central powers)
    468 000 total difference
  8. thelistener Well-Known Member

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    Us lost the tet offensive

    Sherman was a bad tank

    Russians used human wave tactics throughout the second world war

    German tanks were the best in ww2

    Napoleon was the aggressor throughout the Napoleonic wars

    wehrmacht didn't commit war crimes

    (I will just transfer some stuff here from the fun historical facts thread)
    during the ww2 western allied tank kills were mostly done by CAS planes. Wrong only 2-3% of tank kill were done in combat operations by cas planes on all fronts.. http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aviation/myth-combat-aircraft-destroying-tanks-27496.html

    Battle of kursk was mostly a tank battle and the largest one. Wrong, the battle was ultimately won and lost by infantry divisions. And it wasn't the biggest tank battle in history.
    http://www.uni.edu/~licari/citadel.htm
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  9. ddbb089 Well-Known Member

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    The biggest stereotype of history was the Americans losing in vietnam.
    It was a tie okay?
  10. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    @thelistener

    You should get spanked for that. Hardcore.

    To add to this, Napoleon lost more men, than coalition did.


    EDIT: Blocking detachments (USSR) were effectively disbanded by late 1942
  11. thelistener Well-Known Member

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    @D3adtrap wehrmacht committed dozens of war crimes. Thanks to people like manstein who made the imagine of "clean wehrmacht" after the war, the truth hasn't dawned to many people... Sure SS committed more, but still it would be childish to say, wehrmacht wasn't stained with blood during those years.
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  12. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    But you said wermacht did not commit any war crimes or did I miss understood you?
  13. thelistener Well-Known Member

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    Well I figured the thread name is false historical stereotypes.. So yea
  14. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    Oh you meant it that way, god dang it you confused me.

    EDIT: Now your post actually makes sense lol
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  15. MayorEmanuel Do not weep, for salvation is coming.

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    So your source is basically saying that it's a crap shoot, Google scholar might show some reliable results.

    And this is based on what exactly? For starters that offensive should have been much more successful than it ended up being, but Brusilov's colleges refused to coordinate with him. Regardless Russia lost over a million men in that offensive (Axelrod, page 203) and sped up the revolution.
    Placing your only two quality generals on peripheral fronts shows incompetence. Brusilov and Yudenich should have been fighting against the Germans not on lesser opponents such as the Turks and Austrians.
  16. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    Based on what? Based of facts. Find me a more prestigious major victory. What are you going to say? Battle of Somme or Verdun? Oh please.

    Whom am I arguing with here? A 4 year old? The numbers do not lie: 500 000 to 1 350 000. When I present a fact to you and you refuse to accept it and instead you find absurd stats you like. How is anyone supposed to argue with you?

    And your last statement proves my whole argument: Russian Imperial army was not shit like believed, but they kick Austrian & Ottoman asses to oblivion. (With better results than Brits may I add)

    PS: One last question: Do you have any idea, how fucking ridiculous you sound?
  17. scottap25 Well-Known Member

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    Well, there is hardly any argument saying that the Russians were even close to being prepared for war. They rushed straight into it thinking it was their last chance to get a piece of that wonderful Balkan cake. Their unpreparedness probably supports the thought of a pathetic Russian army. Another contributor to that is the fact that THE GENERALS USED OUT OF DATE STRATEGIES! Morale was pathetic, and soldiers formed soviets and refused to fight for the idiotic Czar Nicholas II. So the Russian Army was pretty awful
  18. D3adtrap www.twitter.com/d3adtrap | Mr. Choc: Coco Fruits

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    Take look at the numbers and come back when you got it
  19. scottap25 Well-Known Member

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    ... So the Russians were prepared, their soldiers were happy to fight for a hated Czar, the Generals were the cream of the crop, and their were no soviets in the army.
  20. Jingles Well-Known Member

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    Here's a good one:

    The Japanese were experts at jungle warfare.
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