Issue

pedro3131 · Sep 1, 2011

Chelsea366 said:

Toast said:

Chelsea366 said:

Toast said:

That's not what Observer just said. Though this might not have been a staff issue, I can imagine it still being a serious one, as it was a First Tier Offense.

Since the edit wasn't caught by that quote, for one I apologize for wording it as strongly as I did. However Observer did not say I was letting my emotions get in the way of warnings or bans. If I was I would have warned him. Insults can only be warned if reported, it wasn't. So it wasn't a staff issue.

I appreciate your apology.

I assumed it was a warning to start with, as I saw this on the second page:

Chelsea366 said:

It is not breaking the insult rule, his posts however were.

I'm still going to push my suggestions, regardless, as this thread has served to bolster my worries.

He was breaking the rules, clearly. However there is absolutely nothing we can do about it unless it's reported, officially, by the insulted user.

Actually we don't have to wait for the user to be insulted, as if anyone feels insulted by the comment it's tech an insult. What we usually do is notify the parties involved and figure out how they want to handle it in an attempt to mediate the dispute. That being said, on certain occasions, we have infracted people just based off the content of the insult without contacting the insulted parties.

On the che thing (to Toast) which part do you think was mishandled? I'm not saying we handled it well, but identifying specific moments and actions will help us improve in the future. Until we decide on adding more transparency (which is an ongoing debate for us) I won't release our actual discussions, but we've been mulling it about pretty much since he became unbanned and were just waiting action. A few nights ago he got really out of hand and I pretty much gave an ultimatum that baring Stalin's intervention, I was going to ban Che at X time. Stalin wanted the opportunity to talk to Che to try to reason with him, which is something he has done with other users in the past, before taking any action.

After I got the greenlight, I went ahead and conducted the ban without waiting the 3 or 4 hours until my final ultimatum. I posted a thread about it for two reasons. 1) So we wouldn't get a bunch of threads asking where Che was, or when he was coming back, etc etc. IF you recall we had a bunch of che related threads during his previous bans, so I hoped to bring some sort of closure, or at least a singular place to talk about it as not to clog up the rest of the forums. 2) I wanted a place to explain why he was getting banned, because a permanent ban is pretty serious, and it's something I personally was reluctant to call for until a few days ago. I didn't include our reasoning in the original post, simply because I had a long and rough day personally, and was ready to just go to bed. Looking back, I should have explained our actions in that original post, but I still think removing Che from the community, and taking away his ability to do harm to it, was better then the lesser harm caused by a seemingly boastful thread.

So that's where that is coming from. I really do welcome any criticism of my actions, as while I do have a fruitful life outside of this place, I do take this very seriously and hope to learn from any mistakes I make

theteremaster · Sep 1, 2011

hey guys i just noticed a bunch of people don't have group names.... is it just me?

Chelsea366 · Sep 1, 2011

theteremaster said:

hey guys i just noticed a bunch of people don't have group names.... is it just me?

http://josefvstalin.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=4535
Go there.

theteremaster · Sep 1, 2011

Chelsea366 said:

theteremaster said:

hey guys i just noticed a bunch of people don't have group names.... is it just me?

http://josefvstalin.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=4535
Go there.

yea i just read

i think MayorEmanuel will do his job nicely

Toast · Sep 1, 2011

pedro3131 said:

Actually we don't have to wait for the user to be insulted, as if anyone feels insulted by the comment it's tech an insult. What we usually do is notify the parties involved and figure out how they want to handle it in an attempt to mediate the dispute. That being said, on certain occasions, we have infracted people just based off the content of the insult without contacting the insulted parties.

On the che thing (to Toast) which part do you think was mishandled? I'm not saying we handled it well, but identifying specific moments and actions will help us improve in the future. Until we decide on adding more transparency (which is an ongoing debate for us) I won't release our actual discussions, but we've been mulling it about pretty much since he became unbanned and were just waiting action. A few nights ago he got really out of hand and I pretty much gave an ultimatum that baring Stalin's intervention, I was going to ban Che at X time. Stalin wanted the opportunity to talk to Che to try to reason with him, which is something he has done with other users in the past, before taking any action.

After I got the greenlight, I went ahead and conducted the ban without waiting the 3 or 4 hours until my final ultimatum. I posted a thread about it for two reasons. 1) So we wouldn't get a bunch of threads asking where Che was, or when he was coming back, etc etc. IF you recall we had a bunch of che related threads during his previous bans, so I hoped to bring some sort of closure, or at least a singular place to talk about it as not to clog up the rest of the forums. 2) I wanted a place to explain why he was getting banned, because a permanent ban is pretty serious, and it's something I personally was reluctant to call for until a few days ago. I didn't include our reasoning in the original post, simply because I had a long and rough day personally, and was ready to just go to bed. Looking back, I should have explained our actions in that original post, but I still think removing Che from the community, and taking away his ability to do harm to it, was better then the lesser harm caused by a seemingly boastful thread.

So that's where that is coming from. I really do welcome any criticism of my actions, as while I do have a fruitful life outside of this place, I do take this very seriously and hope to learn from any mistakes I make

Che's banning was inevitably going to spark up a lot of threads and posts asking what's happened to him because he was such an active and controversial user. If this is the case, which I doubt will recur a second time, I suggest locking the thread and (as you've said) provided reasoning, though I guess we can extend this on to every permanent ban as it is an important issue. I understand that this whole situation has spiraled into celebrating, which is what the thread gave me the impression of. Despite a user being banned, I think we should still respect that and abide by the rules when discussing them.

Concerning Stalin trying to coax users back into joining the forums, which he has done once or twice according to you, shouldn't be allowed in my opinion. Doing this would negate all actions against the user beforehand and basically let them off scotfree. Just because a user is considered a friend of Stalin doesn't mean they should be able to get off with breaking rules. I doubt Stalin will take this into account, he rarely does.

theteremaster · Sep 1, 2011

Toast said:

pedro3131 said:

Actually we don't have to wait for the user to be insulted, as if anyone feels insulted by the comment it's tech an insult. What we usually do is notify the parties involved and figure out how they want to handle it in an attempt to mediate the dispute. That being said, on certain occasions, we have infracted people just based off the content of the insult without contacting the insulted parties.

On the che thing (to Toast) which part do you think was mishandled? I'm not saying we handled it well, but identifying specific moments and actions will help us improve in the future. Until we decide on adding more transparency (which is an ongoing debate for us) I won't release our actual discussions, but we've been mulling it about pretty much since he became unbanned and were just waiting action. A few nights ago he got really out of hand and I pretty much gave an ultimatum that baring Stalin's intervention, I was going to ban Che at X time. Stalin wanted the opportunity to talk to Che to try to reason with him, which is something he has done with other users in the past, before taking any action.

After I got the greenlight, I went ahead and conducted the ban without waiting the 3 or 4 hours until my final ultimatum. I posted a thread about it for two reasons. 1) So we wouldn't get a bunch of threads asking where Che was, or when he was coming back, etc etc. IF you recall we had a bunch of che related threads during his previous bans, so I hoped to bring some sort of closure, or at least a singular place to talk about it as not to clog up the rest of the forums. 2) I wanted a place to explain why he was getting banned, because a permanent ban is pretty serious, and it's something I personally was reluctant to call for until a few days ago. I didn't include our reasoning in the original post, simply because I had a long and rough day personally, and was ready to just go to bed. Looking back, I should have explained our actions in that original post, but I still think removing Che from the community, and taking away his ability to do harm to it, was better then the lesser harm caused by a seemingly boastful thread.

So that's where that is coming from. I really do welcome any criticism of my actions, as while I do have a fruitful life outside of this place, I do take this very seriously and hope to learn from any mistakes I make

Che's banning was inevitably going to spark up a lot of threads and posts asking what's happened to him because he was such an active and controversial user. If this is the case, which I doubt will recur a second time, I suggest locking the thread and (as you've said) provided reasoning, though I guess we can extend this on to every permanent ban as it is an important issue. I understand that this whole situation has spiraled into celebrating, which is what the thread gave me the impression of. Despite a user being banned, I think we should still respect that and abide by the rules when discussing them.

Concerning Stalin trying to coax users back into joining the forums, which he has done once or twice according to you, shouldn't be allowed in my opinion. Doing this would negate all actions against the user beforehand and basically let them off scotfree. Just because a user is considered a friend of Stalin doesn't mean they should be able to get off with breaking rules. I doubt Stalin will take this into account, he rarely does.

apparently in aboriginal tradition, when someone dies your not supposed to say their name again. let's try that with che

pedro3131 · Sep 1, 2011

Toast said:

Che's banning was inevitably going to spark up a lot of threads and posts asking what's happened to him because he was such an active and controversial user. If this is the case, which I doubt will recur a second time, I suggest locking the thread and (as you've said) provided reasoning, though I guess we can extend this on to every permanent ban as it is an important issue. I understand that this whole situation has spiraled into celebrating, which is what the thread gave me the impression of. Despite a user being banned, I think we should still respect that and abide by the rules when discussing them.

Concerning Stalin trying to coax users back into joining the forums, which he has done once or twice according to you, shouldn't be allowed in my opinion. Doing this would negate all actions against the user beforehand and basically let them off scotfree. Just because a user is considered a friend of Stalin doesn't mean they should be able to get off with breaking rules. I doubt Stalin will take this into account, he rarely does.

I agree that things have gotten a little celebratory in nature, but I don't know what the solution to that is. I suppose I could have made it a closed thread, but then I'm sure the celebratory comments would have surfaced elsewhere. Certainly mods shouldn't be engaging in celebratory comments. Allow me to rephrase the second part. Stalin would attempt to talk to the guys and make them change their ways. It wasn't really a case of trying to protect a friend, but rather, trying to coax them to contribute to the forums in a positive rather then negative fashion.

theteremaster · Sep 1, 2011

pedro3131 said:

Toast said:

Che's banning was inevitably going to spark up a lot of threads and posts asking what's happened to him because he was such an active and controversial user. If this is the case, which I doubt will recur a second time, I suggest locking the thread and (as you've said) provided reasoning, though I guess we can extend this on to every permanent ban as it is an important issue. I understand that this whole situation has spiraled into celebrating, which is what the thread gave me the impression of. Despite a user being banned, I think we should still respect that and abide by the rules when discussing them.

Concerning Stalin trying to coax users back into joining the forums, which he has done once or twice according to you, shouldn't be allowed in my opinion. Doing this would negate all actions against the user beforehand and basically let them off scotfree. Just because a user is considered a friend of Stalin doesn't mean they should be able to get off with breaking rules. I doubt Stalin will take this into account, he rarely does.

I agree that things have gotten a little celebratory in nature, but I don't know what the solution to that is. I suppose I could have made it a closed thread, but then I'm sure the celebratory comments would have surfaced elsewhere. Certainly mods shouldn't be engaging in celebratory comments. Allow me to rephrase the second part. Stalin would attempt to talk to the guys and make them change their ways. It wasn't really a case of trying to protect a friend, but rather, trying to coax them to contribute to the forums in a positive rather then negative fashion.

i was sick of che the moment i read his first post.

egyptianplanet · Sep 1, 2011

Now, moving on to you. Here is my issue. You have done three things on this forum. You call people racist, try to white knight various issues, and take issue with the administration of the site. Yet you have the audacity to call us out? To be honest, I don't find your complaints worrying at all, considering how little good you have contributed to the community.

I've done plenty as a soldier for the NKVD while you have done nothing but spout hot air and do nothing but act like you're the shit walking around as if you mean something. I've done quite a bit and have gotten back to trying to advance the NKVD as a clan, while I'm fairly certain you didn't even know who josef stalin was prior to this forum.

So why don't you step up or just back the fuck off, because if you want me all to just leave NKVD and take everything I bring to it let me know and I'll do just that. While you remain nothing more than a person with a purple tag that dismisses opinions juxtaposed to your own to make the people on this forum sleep better at night.

So that's where that is coming from. I really do welcome any criticism of my actions, as while I do have a fruitful life outside of this place, I do take this very seriously and hope to learn from any mistakes I make

I appreciate this, pedro. Many of the mods here walk around as if they believe in the infallibility of their own actions, it's nice to know you are not that way.

matthewchris · Sep 1, 2011

egyptianplanet said:

I've done plenty as a soldier for the NKVD while you have done nothing but spout hot air and do nothing but act like you're the shit walking around as if you mean something.

You have done a fair amount, but (in my opinion) you outweigh it with the rants and the whole racism thing. As for me, that isn't really for me to judge what I have done, that is up for the others to decide, and I welcome their opinions. I will say that I do quite a bit behind the scenes involving marketing and advertising, but there is no reason to go into detail.

egyptianplanet said:

I've done quite a bit and have gotten back to trying to advance the NKVD as a clan,

After abandoning it. But hey, at least you came back, so I won't knock you there.

egyptianplanet said:

while I'm fairly certain you didn't even know who josef stalin was prior to this forum.

Personal insults aside, I am relatively well versed in international politics and history, and always have been.

egyptianplanet said:

So why don't you step up or just back the fuck off.

COOOOMMMMMMMMMMEEE ATTTT MEEE BROOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Joking aside though, I am not going to start a spitting match just so we can prove how "cool" we are. So, let's get back on topic, although I will accept some partial blame for attacking your credibility. Back to the issue.

egyptianplanet · Sep 1, 2011

You played in like four tournaments and made a invitational that never panned out. You have done a fair amount, but you outweigh it with the rants and the whole racism thing. As for me, that isn't really for me to judge what I have done, that is up for the others to decide, and I welcome their opinions. I will say that I do quite a bit behind the scenes involving marketing and advertising, but there is no reason to go into detail.

Outside of Johnny and maybe Link I'm the only decent player the NKVD has fielded. And I know you don't know a lot about the clan, you know the gaming part, but SC2 is the more quinessential part to grow the NKVD as a gaming community. I'm not going to say that I'm the most important part, Card is by far, but you acting like you contribute anything at the end of the day rather than hero posts berating my frustration as a Brown person growing up in a White world and how I feel sometimes sure as hell isn't as important as what I've done imo.

Personal insults aside, I am relatively well versed in international politics and history.

Wow, you must be like the only person. The only reason I don't contribute much on that is because I'm more math/science oriented but I can get down right and discuss history anytime. Politics is politics, I'll leave you to your devices.

COOOOMMMMMMMMMMEEE ATTTT MEEE BROOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Joking aside though, I am not going to start a spitting match just so we can prove how "cool" we are. So, let's get back on topic, although I will accept some partial blame for attacking your credibility. Back to the issue.

We are cool, have you seen our pics in the picture thread? I think we're like the coolest people in RL on this forum, man.

Toast · Sep 1, 2011

The NKVD, while being an important asset, doesn't determine where you stand on the forum. Again, saying "fuck off" in spite of all these posts I think you should take into account that the only reason people tried to help you out was because a mod told you to "fuck off". Matt has done a lot more than lounge around with a purple tag, like the NKVD livestream, I don't see how you could see him as "nothing more". If anything Matt sets a good example for what mods should act like.

Coming back to my mod rant, don't expect mods to constantly lick your ass if you throw insults at them. They're expected to endure it to a certain extent but they're still human. They can get pissed off too.

egyptianplanet · Sep 1, 2011

Toast said:

The NKVD, while being an important asset, doesn't determine where you stand on the forum. Again, saying "fuck off" in spite of all these posts I think you should take into account that the only reason people tried to help you out was because a mod told you to "fuck off". Matt has done a lot more than lounge around with a purple tag, like the NKVD livestream, I don't see how you could see him as "nothing more". If anything Matt sets a good example for what mods should act like.

Coming back to my mod rant, don't expect mods to constantly lick your ass if you throw insults at them. They're expected to endure it to a certain extent but they're still human. They can get pissed off too.

Perhaps, let's just say we both made ignorant comments about one another and I too apologize to him for that.

crownedman104 · Sep 1, 2011

Egytian...i have this to say: making enemys of mods...its not smart. xD
I think ive pissed them all off atleast once, i know matt still wishes me dead and idk about chelsea, but honestly not exactly comfortable. xD
While im here tho insulting a mod is blatantly asking for a free boot-to-ass function to occur....
In fact im inclined to believe you were just trolling so you could bitch about biased moderation....

matthewchris · Sep 1, 2011

egyptianplanet said:

You played in like four tournaments and made a invitational that never panned out. You have done a fair amount, but you outweigh it with the rants and the whole racism thing. As for me, that isn't really for me to judge what I have done, that is up for the others to decide, and I welcome their opinions. I will say that I do quite a bit behind the scenes involving marketing and advertising, but there is no reason to go into detail.

Outside of Johnny and maybe Link I'm the only decent player the NKVD has fielded. And I know you don't know a lot about the clan, you know the gaming part, but SC2 is the more quinessential part to grow the NKVD as a gaming community. I'm not going to say that I'm the most important part, Card is by far, but you acting like you contribute anything at the end of the day rather than hero posts berating my frustration as a Brown person growing up in a White world and how I feel sometimes sure as hell isn't as important as what I've done imo.

I think I contribute far more than "hero" posts. But I do know what it's like to be stuck as a minority in a area not so favorable to minorities, and I think would be best if you re-routed your frustration. It may not be my place to tell you what to do, but I will certainly disagree with you over it. That's the nature of a debate forum.

As for your contribution to the clan, I won't attack that. I edited that first part out later, as I realized I was being a little silly. From what I hear, you are a good player.

egyptianplanet said:

We are cool, have you seen our pics in the picture thread? I think we're like the coolest people in RL on this forum, man.

This is true. We may disagree on certain issues, but this arguing is a little silly. Let's hug it out.

egyptianplanet said:

Toast said:

The NKVD, while being an important asset, doesn't determine where you stand on the forum. Again, saying "fuck off" in spite of all these posts I think you should take into account that the only reason people tried to help you out was because a mod told you to "fuck off". Matt has done a lot more than lounge around with a purple tag, like the NKVD livestream, I don't see how you could see him as "nothing more". If anything Matt sets a good example for what mods should act like.

Coming back to my mod rant, don't expect mods to constantly lick your ass if you throw insults at them. They're expected to endure it to a certain extent but they're still human. They can get pissed off too.

Perhaps, let's just say we both made ignorant comments about one another and I too apologize to him for that.

Apology accepted. I apologize as well, for what it is worth.

crownedman104 said:

Egytian...i have this to say: making enemys of mods...its not smart. xD
I think ive pissed them all off atleast once, i know matt still wishes me dead and idk about chelsea, but honestly not exactly comfortable. xD
While im here tho insulting a mod is blatantly asking for a free boot-to-ass function to occur....
In fact im inclined to believe you were just trolling so you could bitch about biased moderation....

I don't wish you dead. If you haven't noticed, I dislike death a lot. About as much as you can without being a pacifist.

crownedman104 · Sep 1, 2011

matthewchris said:

egyptianplanet said:

You played in like four tournaments and made a invitational that never panned out. You have done a fair amount, but you outweigh it with the rants and the whole racism thing. As for me, that isn't really for me to judge what I have done, that is up for the others to decide, and I welcome their opinions. I will say that I do quite a bit behind the scenes involving marketing and advertising, but there is no reason to go into detail.

Outside of Johnny and maybe Link I'm the only decent player the NKVD has fielded. And I know you don't know a lot about the clan, you know the gaming part, but SC2 is the more quinessential part to grow the NKVD as a gaming community. I'm not going to say that I'm the most important part, Card is by far, but you acting like you contribute anything at the end of the day rather than hero posts berating my frustration as a Brown person growing up in a White world and how I feel sometimes sure as hell isn't as important as what I've done imo.

I think I contribute far more than "hero" posts. But I do know what it's like to be stuck as a minority in a area not so favorable to minorities, and I think would be best if you re-routed your frustration. It may not be my place to tell you what to do, but I will certainly disagree with you over it. That's the nature of a debate forum.

As for your contribution to the clan, I won't attack that. I edited that first part out later, as I realized I was being a little silly. From what I hear, you are a good player.

egyptianplanet said:

We are cool, have you seen our pics in the picture thread? I think we're like the coolest people in RL on this forum, man.

This is true. We may disagree on certain issues, but this arguing is a little silly. Let's hug it out.

egyptianplanet said:

Toast said:

The NKVD, while being an important asset, doesn't determine where you stand on the forum. Again, saying "fuck off" in spite of all these posts I think you should take into account that the only reason people tried to help you out was because a mod told you to "fuck off". Matt has done a lot more than lounge around with a purple tag, like the NKVD livestream, I don't see how you could see him as "nothing more". If anything Matt sets a good example for what mods should act like.

Coming back to my mod rant, don't expect mods to constantly lick your ass if you throw insults at them. They're expected to endure it to a certain extent but they're still human. They can get pissed off too.

Perhaps, let's just say we both made ignorant comments about one another and I too apologize to him for that.

Apology accepted. I apologize as well, for what it is worth.

crownedman104 said:

Egytian...i have this to say: making enemys of mods...its not smart. xD
I think ive pissed them all off atleast once, i know matt still wishes me dead and idk about chelsea, but honestly not exactly comfortable. xD
While im here tho insulting a mod is blatantly asking for a free boot-to-ass function to occur....
In fact im inclined to believe you were just trolling so you could bitch about biased moderation....

I don't wish you dead. If you haven't noticed, I dislike death a lot. About as much as you can without being a pacifist.

Aight, you and me dont exactly see eye to eye, better?

Chelsea366 · Sep 1, 2011

crownedman104 said:

Egytian...i have this to say: making enemys of mods...its not smart. xD
I think ive pissed them all off atleast once, i know matt still wishes me dead and idk about chelsea, but honestly not exactly comfortable. xD
While im here tho insulting a mod is blatantly asking for a free boot-to-ass function to occur....
In fact im inclined to believe you were just trolling so you could bitch about biased moderation....

I don't like some people at all here but it's not going to make me treat you differently with the rules. I might not be the nicest person to you but I wont abuse my powers and I feel that most mods here would never do that either. Though crowned, my feelings about you are up in the air. I am waiting to see how you act in the future. If you don't say any more pointless hate filled things then I'm ok.

Toast · Sep 1, 2011

The tears, they are flowing.

crownedman104 · Sep 1, 2011

Chelsea366 said:

crownedman104 said:

Egytian...i have this to say: making enemys of mods...its not smart. xD
I think ive pissed them all off atleast once, i know matt still wishes me dead and idk about chelsea, but honestly not exactly comfortable. xD
While im here tho insulting a mod is blatantly asking for a free boot-to-ass function to occur....
In fact im inclined to believe you were just trolling so you could bitch about biased moderation....

I don't like some people at all here but it's not going to make me treat you differently with the rules. I might not be the nicest person to you but I wont abuse my powers and I feel that most mods here would never do that either. Though crowned, my feelings to you are up in the air. I am waiting to see how you act in the future. If you don't say any more pointless hate filled things then I'm ok.

Yay.
(this part included so that i dont break 1 worded post rule)

egyptianplanet · Sep 1, 2011

This is true. We may disagree on certain issues, but this arguing is a little silly. Let's hug it out.

[yt:1oadjd1s]HQBFYw8VaPc[/yt:1oadjd1s]

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