So I just finished watching Stalin’s 2nd part Shogun 2 demo let’s play, and I just need to vent real quick... Is anyone else as annoyed out of their mind as I am in regards to the ninja in Shogun 2? As someone who was once utterly obsessed with Japanese history, especially during the Sengoku period, this whole ninja business is probably one of my biggest pet peeves in life. To begin, basically, the ninja in Shogun 2 are ahistorical, fantasy. First of all, their appearance. You know those black pajamas they always wear? Yeah... no. If they wore those at night it would be a detriment as you can see black at night easily from it’s silhouette, night isn’t black after all, it’s more of a dark blue. Hence why the real, historical spies and assassins of feudal Japan would wear dark blue during night missions. In fact, the painted image they used in Shogun 2 of a ninja (the image that pops up after the ninja completes his mission) is wearing historically accurate dark blue clothing, yet Creative Assembly decided to go with the ahistorical Hollywood black pajamas for the actual unit graphic. WHY?! Everything else in the game seems great, like they went out of their way to be historically accurate, but then they go and ruin it all with this ninja BS. Then there is still the other ninja fantasy crap like the smoke bomb/flash grenade thing they use, which is a complete Hollywood fabrication. Same with the ninja-to (a katana like sword with a straighter, shorter blade, and a square guard), though it looks like Creative Assembly might have given the ninja a katana instead of a ninja-to which is at least some relief. Stalin says several times in the demo let’s play that he loves how they give him ninja on the battlefield, and I don’t necessarily disagree, I see what he’s saying, it does look like fun, being able to sneak a special ops force into an enemy castle like that. I’m not saying such a unit shouldn’t have been designed into the game, I’m merely stating that they could have gone about it much more true to history. Yes there were ninja in Sengoku Japan, shinobi they called them, just like in ever other civilization in the history of warfare there are those who are spies, assassins, and saboteurs. But the black pajama wearing, shuriken star throwing, smoke bomb tossing, ninja-to wielding, acrobatic, stealth martial artist assassin of Japan, is pure fantasy. Creative Assembly, I am disappoint. Thank you that is all.
Ever noticed the Arcani units in Rome? Well, they're about as historically correct as the Shogun 2 ninjas you described. Games will never be 100% historically correct (well, most of the time they won't), and I think Creative Assembly just wanted players to be familiar with the ninjas they know.
Yes, Rome: Total War had tons of fantasy units... and I was annoyed by that and complained about it. Now they put fantasy units in Shogun 2, and I shall continue to complain, because I am annoyed. And I know games will never be 100% historically accurate, but what bothers me is that it’s as if they went out of their way to be historically inaccurate in this case.
Meh, I'm not really upset by the way they are in the game. I am simply glad they have the ninja assassination movies. Of course there are going to be historical inaccuracies in a TW game but the way they are in the game is not something I have a problem with personally. I'm more concerned about the clans when it comes to historical accuracy but I don't really see anything being so inaccurate that I will not be able to fully immerse myself in the game.
Another thing I thought about was the armour. If I recall correctly the samurais rarely ever wore that heavy armour in battle since it was unpractical and reduced the ability to move and fight swiftly. I don't have a problem with it though, the armour look truly badass.
They have to be in full armor because like you said it looks badass. I don't care how hard or easy it is for my troops to move or fight, they have to look awesome! xD However I do believe that the samurai armor is accurate. No armor looks as badass to me as full samurai armor.
Generally, ninjas didn't wear any kind of uniform. They tended to go around disguised as commoners. Much less likely to arouse suspicion than the Hollywood-esque balaclava suits.
Hmmm... I'm not sure that's accurate, where did you hear that? Or maybe I've just not noticed the heavy armor you're talking about? Exactly! It makes much more sense to disguise yourself as a peasant, guard, merchant, monk, or whatever and just walk into the castle through the front gates. I think the various disguises your assassin could use and the realistic tactics and methods used to reach his target would have been much more interesting for the assassination cutscenes.
Well if you look at this for example: That's what I mean... I'm not an expert though and my sources could be wrong.
I don't see anything wrong with that image, looks like typical 16th century Japanese armor to me. Can you post a link to the sources you're getting this idea from?
Well, I read it in a swedish history magasine but that was awhile ago and I'm probably not recalling correctly.
Yeah I do think the samurai armor is accurate and I do agree that ninjas would have usually disguised themselves as commoners or monks.
Can we agree that Rome Total War was as historically accurate as Stalin vs The Martians lol. They had Rome divided into three factions, Urban Cohorts, and the Romans had excellent cavalry?????? Also, the egyptians seemed to have risen from the dead from 1000 years earlier,. instead of being the diadochi Ptolemaics, and with in 40 years(at most) u concuered most of the world, and the Seleucids were destroyed in 10-20 lol However, it was fun. Thats y they should make another rome total war so they can fix the historical innacuricies while still keeping the bright and fun gameplay (one thing i hate about the mods is that they are so bland, specifically Europa Barbarorum in battle) Also, I hate Urban Cohorts with a passion online,and often ban them cuz they r so innacuraste. As to the ninjas, I could live with, since u can never make a game perfectly accurate.
Europa Barbarorum is the mod that I use. I don't mind the blandness you speak of, if it makes the battlefield more realistic and less cartoony looking, then I'm happy. The only real problem with EB that I have is that hammer and anvil strikes never seem to work very efficiently. Though maybe that’s just because I’m doing something wrong, or maybe because historically hammer and anvil strikes may not have been as effective as they are portrayed in vanilla RTW, I'm not sure.
Definatly hammer and anvil wasnt anything like in the vannila but it was still effective. I was playing as carthage and after having my whole army destroyed except for my 2 roundsheild units and generals body guard. The roman army was still relitivly intact but after chages from the front(yes from the front) my cavalry would rout their infanty (hastati and princepts) almost instantaniously with the charge doing more damage then a templar or hospitaler knight charging against a unit of archer militia in medieval 2
